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  • #20178
    Avatar of Elwar
    Elwar
    Participant

    Funding suggestion for ya…

    Most manufacturers count on the cost of the final retail product being several times the manufacturer cost. Manufacturer sells to wholesaler, who sells to distributor who sells to retailer who sells to the end user. Each one along the way wants their cut.

    So you could sell the opportunity to be able to buy the first Bergsteads at cost.

    Say the final product will cost $40-50k to build but the final cost to the buyer is going to be closer to $100k. You ask for a $5k contribution now in order to lock in a Bergstead at the $40-50k price.

    For cheaper products on kickstarter I have seen them sell the actual product for a contribution of like $1k (the manufactured cost of the product). So the first X people will get it at manufacturer’s cost and then you start making profit.

    Just a thought.

    #20161
    Avatar of Elwar
    Elwar
    Participant

    That is quite cool.

    The only problem is that it uses helium to stay up. Helium eventually escapes and needs to be re-filled. Helium is not an abundant element. The claim of this being “environmentally friendly” when it uses helium is a stretch.

    cool concept though

    #20156
    Avatar of Elwar
    Elwar
    Participant

    “What links, if any do you have?”

    No links. No edit.

    #20106
    Avatar of Elwar
    Elwar
    Participant

    “On that basis, it would be impossible to give fully-informed consent to being part of any seastead, or any organization of any kind.”

    True. The best route is to have full consent for every action. This would require a vote by all. If full consent is not realized, then force needs to be used against those who do not agree. Since you are doing something against someone’s will.

    #20105
    Avatar of Elwar
    Elwar
    Participant

    ugh…I cannot believe we cannot edit or preview our posts.

    I was trying to point to this pic:
    http://www.featurepics.com/FI/Thumb300/20061029/Six-Pack-Holder-123709.jpg

    #20104
    Avatar of Elwar
    Elwar
    Participant

    Since you are recycling, do you think the six pack holders would be strong enough to keep the bottles together?

    Like these:

    If they are still around anyway…

    #20046
    Avatar of Elwar
    Elwar
    Participant

    Ahh. I am in complete support of people joining any group for which they know what they are getting into before they go into it.

    So they can say “you will be a slave if you come on our seastead”. If you get on the seastead you have made the choice to become a slave/live under communism.

    But you do not have “fully-informed consent” as in, you are not fully informed on what the central group will decide upon in the future. You may go on there expecting a communist utopia and then the central group decides that they want that crazy free market capitalism to take over. You go from sitting there asking for free handouts to being expected to put in some effort in exchange for stuff.

    #20044
    Avatar of Elwar
    Elwar
    Participant

    “What about a communist seastead with fully-informed consent?”

    Full consent of all is ideal for any sort of government. I have tried to figure out a voting system where full consent would pass laws but I cannot get past the fact that infiltration by someone acting against the group can always be that single “no” vote just to harm the group.

    #20043
    Avatar of Elwar
    Elwar
    Participant

    Looks great!

    They look pretty solid and when floating should provide a fairly flat surface which is handy.

    My only worry (other than the bottle caps rusting out) would be the price of the cable ties. $6 per block may not seem like much, but scaling up it is a lot. You may want to look into what the bulk pricing may be or if there is something similar that is cheaper. If the price drops significantly for large quantities then it is nothing to worry about.

    Try testing out the 7 connected first. It should give you a good idea of how they will act when connected.

    #20029
    Avatar of Elwar
    Elwar
    Participant

    Will there be some sort of interface with some sort of machines or robots which can punish those who do not conform?

    With communism you must use fear and pain to motivate people. Communism takes reward out of the productivity equation so you must have a good method of instilling fear into people in order for them to be productive.

    Unless you just want an unproductive society and everyone starves and dies. Probably a better option than the fear option. More humane too.

    #19991
    Avatar of Elwar
    Elwar
    Participant

    “If they rule against floating homes being houses won’t this set a legal precedent and be really difficult to change in the future? If they rule against seasteading then all floating homes will have to be mobile right? The out of sight out of mind idea for floating homes makes sense to me until cities are ready to accept floating homes as houses.”

    This will mainly determine what is a home and what is a vessel.

    If a floating home is designated a vessel, then it does not necessarily mean that it will have to be mobile, it will just have to follow all of the laws that a vessel has. And it will lose all the rights you get from a home (ie. the government may board your vessel at any time to inspect it, etc.).

    There is a give and take for each type of definition. A home can have property taxes levied upon it and can be subject to local jurisdiction house laws (water restrictions, visual restrictions, etc.). A vessel can be treated like an object and seized or moved as needed.

    Of course, this is all for floating homes within a state’s jurisdiction. This mainly concerns those who wish to build something and start out close to shore before developing something to be miles out to sea.

    #19793
    Avatar of Elwar
    Elwar
    Participant

    “Even $200 or $300 total cost for a seastead I can camp on with a tent is till a pretty good deal.”

    It sounds like that is the initial goal of many of us here for our prototypes.

    It would be interesting to see if the Seasteading Institute could put up a challenge of paying $1,000 each toward potential applicants to make a seastead that is good enough to spend the night on with a tent.

    Then they can designate a judge to go spend the night at each of these seasteads and rate them and give the winner/s a prize.

    It would probably kick a few of us into high gear to get something going by this summer.

    #19783
    Avatar of Elwar
    Elwar
    Participant

    Just a quick question…how are you sealing your bottles?

    Glass should hold up long term to saltwater but any type of metal or plastic will be gone within a year.

    My cheap grill fell into the canal about half a year ago and instead of pulling it out I kept it in just to observe how long it would take for it to completely dissolve. It is certainly rusted at this point and not all there. Most likely within the year it will not resemble a grill anymore.

    Considering you do not have too much pressure against just the tips, I would suggest mixing a very wet batch of ferrocement and just dip the ends in it to at least coat the metal part. That could work.

    I try to think of seasteads as something that should last close to 100 years. Maybe this is a poor assumption with such a new concept.

    #19761
    Avatar of Elwar
    Elwar
    Participant

    Well, I am glad that at least the Supreme Court will have a say into what is a vessel and what is a house. At least to have some clarity and be able to work along the lines on either side whether I want to pay taxes on a home or adhere to the guidelines of owning a vessel.

    I thought of another thing that I could not figure out if it needs to be registered. Those shuttle craft boats that have no propulsion but you use your jetski to move it. I do know that California considers those as a vessel that needs to be registered.

    I hate when “intent” is involved with law. It relies upon what someone may be thinking which is akin to laws against certain thought.

    I do not know how I would differentiate between a vessel and a home. It will not be an easy task and I look forward to the outcome of the Supreme Court decision for some clarity.

    #19554
    Avatar of Elwar
    Elwar
    Participant

    Good job getting started with experimenting. Glass is an interesting material to test. I suppose it should last in salt water, but the obvious question would be durability. Huge waves crashing against something over and over needs to be durable.

    This could definitely be a great option for a cheap platform in steady water or behind a breakwater.

    I like the mangrove testing. I am curious to see how long it takes for them to grow. Where are you growing them? Saltwater?

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