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WAVELAND-MODULAR MOBILE OFFSHORE BASE

Home Forums Archive Structure Designs WAVELAND-MODULAR MOBILE OFFSHORE BASE

This topic contains 39 replies, has 12 voices, and was last updated by Avatar of tusavision tusavision 3 years, 8 months ago.

Viewing 10 posts - 31 through 40 (of 40 total)
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  • #5995
    Avatar of jcrawford
    jcrawford
    Participant

    While I’m no shipwright, I think this design has great potential. My key concern is the issue of crops on the top deck. as has been observed, splashes of saltwater would leave quite a bit of salt in the soil, which would make it very difficult to grow food crops. And, of course, getting food shipped in all the time would be prohibitive. From an aesthetic perspective, having the crops uncovered is best, and may do better for them as plants in good weather. I’m wondering about the possibility of some kind of modular greenhouse cover that could be placed over the crops in poor weather. This would be good for growth as well, since the temperature/humidity/water to the crops could be regulated and damage from heavy winds and seaspray minimized. Such a system would preferably fold up from the deck, perhaps even on pneumatics so it can be done automatically (I work with robotics, so I’m all for this kind of automation).

    I love your idea about using the oversized wind-gen masts to support a second deck, but I wonder how feasible this is with only one such mast per unit. It would probably require multiple masts to support a structure of any size, which would require permanently securing the KM200s in a given formation. That could be inconvenient. Would it be possible/cost effective/worthwhile to add a second to each KM200? It would be best if a mast was not in place, but the deck structure was designed to support a second one, with a place where one could easily be added on at a later time. The second mast could also be used for any other large objects you wanted up in the air, like a small “crow’s nest” observation deck or even a weapons system or a system for catching and launching UAVs for interplatform shipments (the possibility of using UAVs for shipping between platforms, with aircraft-carrier-style landing and launch systems, is something I’m very interested in).

    Of course, when I think about it, it occurs to me that adding an upper deck would raise the center of gravity enough that permanently securing several platforms together would probably be necessary.

    #5999
    Avatar of OCEANOPOLIS
    OCEANOPOLIS
    Participant

    As shown, the top deck is designed as recreation area, w/pools and gardens. A crop area can be done @ the second deck, as a greenhouse, w/ artificial lights. There are 7 decks in total. The whole design is intended to be more like a resort than anything else. But it can be anything. I just wanted to show the modular aspect. A second mast can be added on the bow. I thought of it after taking the photos. It is a good ideea. Also support columns shud be added if a 2nd deck is to be built, yes.

    #6675
    Avatar of tomohern
    tomohern
    Participant

    I haven’t seen that anyone has calculated the force that would be put on the cleats holding the modules together when a wave of significant height passed under the area where the two ships were connected.

    I have been working of a modular idea of my own but have not been able to overcome this problem. Either you need a large number of steel cables or beams that protrude from the modules and interlock the two together. Both options require huge structural reinforcement but I am guessing the first option would be better because it would provide multiple levels of failure protection. I still am not comfortable though that it could be made to really secure two vessels of this size together.

    Any thoughts?

    #6676
    Avatar of
    Anonymous

    Springs and/or shock absorbers could perhaps be used to lessen the peak forces between modules. A simple and (maybe) cheap shock absorber might be possible if you used sea water instead of hydraulic fluid. That way you probably could also make them relatively crudely, without too fine tolerances.

    #6677
    Avatar of OCEANOPOLIS
    OCEANOPOLIS
    Participant

    Yes, this is the Big Question…It had preoccupied my attention since the conception of this design,… The easiest way out would be to unraft when bad weather hits and each module will ride it on its own. Another option would be to raft up the modules to this formation http://wiki.seasteading.org/images/9/98/006.JPG and make it permanent by mechanically secure them. Now this structure will be one big module. Put together 8 of them, raft them up, secure, and you have one huge module. It can be done ad infinitum.

    It all depends on how we look @ modularity in relation to the whole seasteading concept. My view is that modularity is just a neccesary process to achive the goal, but not a status quo. With other words its not really neccesary to be able to raft up and unraft 1000 times,…and be rock solid in the process. I would be very happy if I’d have 8 kite modules rafted up solid, as one pice, as shown in the picture above. Modularity has achived its goal. Period. Next step,..next module.

    But coming back to the point here, I think I have come up w/ a system of rafting up which is simple, and will provide the required strength. I will draw a sketch and post it tomorrow, and any feedback will really be appreciated. Ahoy, O.

    #6678
    Avatar of Jeff-Chan
    Jeff-Chan
    Participant

    Just some quick comments that I like many things about this design: ferrocement material, high freeboard, relatively closed hull, somewhat streamlined hull shape for better mobility through the water (and air), relatively shallow draft (especially compared to a spar buoy), modular, etc.

    Tsunamis, waves, rogue waves and storms are a problem for most things floating on the sea. Rafting is also highly problematic, especially for anything ship-like. The problem in all cases is wave energy imparting motion to the hulls. That would put enormous strain on the rafting or joining structures.

    One answer is that the effect of waves can be minimized by minimizing waterplane area such as with spars, etc.

    A solution the U.S. Navy proposed for the rafting problem is to have flexible bridges connecting ships or barges that are not right next to each other. The bridges would only work in small waves in their scenarios. I think a meter or three wave height was envisioned. If the waves got too big, then the bridges would be retracted.

    Regarding this kite design, if it can’t be closely rafted, then it loses some of the modularity advantage, and something like a hexagonal- or circular-decked spar bouy connected with flexible bridges may be better.

    That all said, it’s always exciting and interesting to see fresh ideas.

    Regarding abandoning seasteads in storms, most helicopters have an unrefueled range of only a couple hundred nautical miles. They’re also relatively slow and relatively low passenger capacity. Seaplanes have longer range and larger capacity but can’t operate in big waves.

    Regarding keeping a ship pointed into a the wind in a storm, a navigation computer might be able to do it, even if no one was on board.

    #6689
    Avatar of OCEANOPOLIS
    OCEANOPOLIS
    Participant

    This is how i was planning to raft them up. http://wiki.seasteading.org/index.php/Image:RAFT_UP.jpg.

    To Jeff Chan. Ty for your comments. Rafting up seems to be a problem for any shape module, but i belive that my system will solve that. Also, I never said that the seastead will be abandoned in a storm, but unrafted, so the modules can ride it on their own.

    #12422
    Avatar of tusavision
    tusavision
    Participant

    Real estate which floods during emergency conditions is not unique to land. The easiest way for seasteading real estate to survive big waves is an early warning network combined with variable buoyancy and an escape submarine.

    Put the human occupants in a pressure hull and dive. Everything else dives and stays dry with compressed air. This requires air tight living space which suggests eden project green houses. If you don’t want to live in a bubble, then your entire living space should be water proof because you’ll have to flood it to duck dive under the wave.

    For minor waves: Car tire shock absorbers are the only cost effective material for keeping multiple concrete barges from smashing in to each other. The navy uses them when tying two ships together at sea for a reason, and they have a bigger budget than we do.

    Making the hull typical of traditional boats seems reasonable, and I recommend borrowing from the Original WWII U-boats in appearance as the mission requirements are similar(long periods on the surface with small periods in between.

    Travel between vessels would be best accomplished by Zip Lines using counter weights and pulleys to keep the lines taught. Life preservers would be necessary in case the zip line exceeded it’s breaking strength in transit and a seasteader would need to be fished from the water.

    Moving away from the intuitive honeycomb seastead to a more bacteria based one is both conductive to fuel efficient travel, but lashing together multiple seasteads as well.

    Shape the seasteads like submarines, put a bunch of green house blisters on the upper deck. Give the green houses long snorkels. Put used tire shock absorbers on the nose and tail of the submarines and you can lash them together in a long wagon caravan train for traveling, or you can “circle the wagons” as a wave break for community activities like “sunday market”, fish farming, or athletic sports.

    #12424
    Avatar of OCEANOPOLIS
    OCEANOPOLIS
    Participant

    with some of your views. Tires have been used for decades as fenders for rafting up barges, towing or docking and in my oppinion too are the cheapest way to go. For the project I described above I would actualy use tractor tires (the big rear ones) because of the size of the freeboard (70′). I don’t see “flooding” as a problem since, again, the freeboard of those structures is 70′. (if we are talking about the kitefloat models). Yes, there might be some occasional spray over the bow while riding the big seas, but that is normal under those circumstances. (if that what you meant by “flooding” – a bit unclear, sry). The escape submarine is a good idea for the extreme cases of abandoning ship and I can imagine a hybrid life raft – submarine design. Still, the modern life boats and life raft are build for any sea conditions and they are claimed to be unsinkable. Why spend the extra money? Designing and building such hybrid life boat-submarines will be a huge expense,…

    I said it before, I personally don’t think of substeading as an acceptable answer or solution to the whole seasteading idea. There is one think to have personal seasteading preferences like substeading and a total different thing when we are talking mainstream seasteading. But I do think that submarines can be a powerfull seasteading business “tool” to have around a surface seastead. Mainly a cash generating tool. From being able to generate income by offering sub tours to the tourists who are visiting the seastead, exploration and survey of the sea floor, treasure hunting, defense (I would say very important), underwater hull repairs (when needed), etc.

    For traveling between seastead I would prefer the old fashion tenders, shuttle boats, or jet skis. But I am a kind’of an old fashioned sailor:) Whatever will do efficiently ok by me.

    #12438
    Avatar of tusavision
    tusavision
    Participant

    tusavision wrote:

    Real estate which floods during emergency conditions is not unique to land. The easiest way for seasteading real estate to survive big waves is an early warning network combined with variable buoyancy and an escape submarine.

    Put the human occupants in a pressure hull and dive. Everything else dives and stays dry with compressed air. This requires air tight living space which suggests eden project green houses. If you don’t want to live in a bubble, then your entire living space should be water proof because you’ll have to flood it to duck dive under the wave.

    For minor waves: Car tire shock absorbers are the only cost effective material for keeping multiple concrete barges from smashing in to each other. The navy uses them when tying two ships together at sea for a reason, and they have a bigger budget than we do.

    Making the hull typical of traditional boats seems reasonable, and I recommend borrowing from the Original WWII U-boats in appearance as the mission requirements are similar(long periods on the surface with small periods in between.

    Travel between vessels would be best accomplished by Zip Lines using counter weights and pulleys to keep the lines taught. Life preservers would be necessary in case the zip line exceeded it’s breaking strength in transit and a seasteader would need to be fished from the water.

    Moving away from the intuitive honeycomb seastead to a more bacteria based one is both conductive to fuel efficient travel, but lashing together multiple seasteads as well.

    Shape the seasteads like submarines, put a bunch of green house blisters on the upper deck. Give the green houses long snorkels. Put used tire shock absorbers on the nose and tail of the submarines and you can lash them together in a long wagon caravan train for traveling, or you can “circle the wagons” as a wave break for community activities like “sunday market”, fish farming, or athletic sports.

    http://www.lowtechmagazine.com/2011/01/aerial-ropeways-automatic-cargo-transport.html

Viewing 10 posts - 31 through 40 (of 40 total)

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