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WaterWalker from used utility poles and big buoys

Home Forums Archive Structure Designs WaterWalker from used utility poles and big buoys

This topic contains 65 replies, has 12 voices, and was last updated by Profile photo of Dil Dil 5 years, 10 months ago.

Viewing 15 posts - 46 through 60 (of 66 total)
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  • #4663
    Profile photo of Jesrad
    Jesrad
    Participant

    Let’s say you extend the poles up past the hinge and add a few cables on the top just like those on the bottom:

    That way you can easily put a fixed platform at the top, and keep the tensegrity structure without too much of an heavy modification. Then you may attempt seperating the poles from each other (using the platform as a spacer ?)

    The last step is to double the number of poles, but twisting the second set of poles the other way, into a simplified hyperboloid tower ;)

    #4664
    Profile photo of vincecate
    vincecate
    Participant

    Something like that table would interesting. My bottom width is like 32 feet diagonal and the human platform was 4 feet, so I don’t want the top and the bottom the same width. Does not seem like that design can be stretched to such differences for top and bottom.

    If I was using 40 foot telephone poles I could drill holes in them like 6 feet from the end and cross them all and tie them together where I drilled. So the tops would be short and the bottom very wide.

    #4665
    Profile photo of vincecate
    vincecate
    Participant

    Thanks to TSI, I was able to get this nice camera with a 20x zoom. Got some nice shots from shore. Uploaded 2 more movies and still have more to do. Without that it would not have been documented so well. Thanks!

    #4666
    Profile photo of SPyle
    SPyle
    Participant

    Fantastic to see a physical realisation of the seasteading idea.

    #4670
    Profile photo of
    Anonymous

    The table relies on the weight of the glass top and support from the floor to apply tension to the cables by pressing down on the tops of the struts. For a seastead, struts would need to be added to the top to replace the glass.

    #4671
    Profile photo of
    Anonymous

    It may be possible to link tensegrity waterwalker modules into a tensegrity truss with the habitats connected with suspended walkways.

    #4680
    Profile photo of vincecate
    vincecate
    Participant

    I have found a Cabrina Convert 9 M kite for sale in Anguilla. It is a 2008 model that is hardly used. The price is $675 for kite, bar, and harness. The kite easily water-launches after a crash. It can also “de-power”, so if we don’t want it to pull we just push up on the bar.

    With this bigger and better kite it would be practical to fly in lighter winds (last kite was 12 year old model and damaged some in storage). In lighter winds the wind on the structure would be less of an issue. We sort of had simulated 50 MPH winds last time. With this kite we should be able to get a better angle off of straight down-wind. For kite powered migration we really want a better angle than I got on the first voyage. But with this I think I can show that kites alone are reasonable to get you near land (engines for going in/out of harbors).

    I am looking for sponsors that would be willing to pay something after I buy this kite and complete at least a 1.5 mile trip with WaterWalker2. Anyone want to see a trip bad enough to commit to sponsor something? If I can get at least $400 total sponsorship I will buy the kite and do the trip. You only pay with PayPal after I complete the 1.5+ mile trip and document it on the wiki.

    Here is a link to the kite:

    http://www.ksmaui.com/store/products/2008_Cabrinha_Convert-175-23.html

    I have finished uploading videos and writing up WaterWalker2 events so far:

    http://wiki.seasteading.org/index.php/User:Vincecate/WaterWalker2

    http://wiki.seasteading.org/index.php/User:Vincecate/WaterWalker2Page2

    — Vince

    #4683
    Profile photo of Joep
    Joep
    Participant

    Hi Vince,

    The previous projects both have shown to be tangible successes, go on like that! I pledge $150 for the next success.

    -Joep

    #4684
    Profile photo of vincecate
    vincecate
    Participant

    >The previous projects both have shown to be tangible successes, go on like that! I pledge $150 for the next success.

    >-Joep

    Thanks much! And also thanks for your previous support. Only $250 to go!

    — Vince

    #4685
    Profile photo of livefreeortry
    livefreeortry
    Participant

    Hi Vince, what is your opinion about the usage of kites to harness high altitude wind power, as discussed in the following thread and the links therein: http://www.seasteading.org/interact/forums/engineering/infrastructure/harnessing-high-altitude-wind-power ; and some attempts made by a few people : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GractDA9IBU , http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IHim2Vnkikw

    I remember you’d mentioned that kites could be used for energy generation in conjunction with providing propulsion for cruise ships, using a propellor immersed in water.

    The basic idea I have is that a kite is allowed to spool out its string, which turns a turbine, storing the energy either in batteries or compressed air etc, and on reaching the end of the tether, the angle of attack is changed to reduce/eliminate wind load, and the kite is pulled back to original position by expending an amount of energy lesser than that generated earlier.

    I’d like to pledge US$ 150 for the purchase of the above kite if you can also try out generating energy using the kite. What I have in mind is that you could set up a simple manually controlled system, and measure the net energy balance over say 50 cycles,to estimate the potential of this idea. I want an approximate co-relation between kite size, wind speed and energy generated

    What do you think?? We can discuss this in greater detail with some possible mechanisms if you’re interested.

    #4686
    Profile photo of vincecate
    vincecate
    Participant


    I’d like to pledge US$ 150 for the purchase of the above kite if you can also try out generating energy using the kite. What I have in mind is that you could set up a simple manually controlled system, and measure the net energy balance over say 50 cycles,to estimate the potential of this idea. I want an approximate co-relation between kite size, wind speed and energy generated

    I could have the kite attached to me, then a rope from me over a pulley to a 5 gallon bucket. I could have an assistant dip the bucket in water, have the kite pull me forward and so lift up the bucket, then as my assistant dumps the water I ease the kite power off and then walk backward and repeat. The pulley would be high enough that I was lifting the bucket at least 5 feet. On the video you will be able to see if I am leaning to fight the kite or not, or leaning to lift up the bucket. I will try to have it be mostly the kite clearly. If I published a video of me doing that 50 times would that be worth $150 to you?

    I made a video this weekend of me lifting a 5 gallon bucket full of water using my Hobie Outback with both pedal and paddle power. So the bucket, pulley, and rope are ready. Just need the kite. :-)

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MtCAGKTKPTA

    – Vince

    #4687
    Profile photo of livefreeortry
    livefreeortry
    Participant

    I’d like your frank opinion about the feasibility of this idea and how the energy output can be maximized.. The pledge stands at US$ 150 even if your opinion is unfavorable.

    An accurate energy balance requires that the energy spent in pulling the kite back to its original position after depowering be accounted for as well. Maybe your assistant should not dump all the water, say 1-1.5 gallons remains in the bucket to provide force to pull the kite back? Can you try and optimize these numbers to get the maximum difference?

    When you say the kite is depowered, how much of a difference does it make compared to when its configured to catch the full force of the wind? For optimum energy harvesting, this difference has to as great as possible. Can you think of some ways to maximize this difference?

    #4688
    Profile photo of vincecate
    vincecate
    Participant

    If you look at this video you can get some idea of the difference between powered and depowered. I don’t have the kite, but I think we are talking 10 lbs pull when depowered and 200 lbs when powered.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=guIFwRfkAkc

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VuMS3qPwqMc

    I could go up an incline when the kite was pulling me forward. This way when I was going backward I would not have to put in energy myself. But I don;t think this is very significant.

    If I have a kite for propulsion and I don’t need airconditioning my power needs will be very small. Solar is reliable, simple, quiet, and not very expensive for the amount of power I need. So for a single familly seastead I just don’t see any need to do anything other than solar for electricity. Electricity just does not look like a problem.

    So some new and unproven method of power geneation is not necessary. It is really adding extra risks where we don’t need them. It is kind of fun and interesting. But it does not get us closer to practical seasteads. So my frank opinion is, it can probably be done, but why bother?

    Now propulsion is an issue. We seasteaders think that sacrificing “streamline water shape” in order to get stability and low cost is a good tradeoff. However, we run the risk of having something that will eat too much diesel when we try to move it. So propulsion is an issue. I think with large propellers and electric motors we could do it. I also think a kite can do it. But there is an issue here.

    Anyway, will you pay $150 to see me lift some buckets of water using a kite?

    #4689
    Profile photo of livefreeortry
    livefreeortry
    Participant

    Anyway, will you pay $150 to see me lift some buckets of water using a kite?

    Yes I will.

    I don’t have the kite, but I think we are talking 10 lbs pull when depowered and 200 lbs when powered.

    If the powered force is 200 lbs, then a 5 gallon bucket will not suffice.. you could lift a solid weight with a hook and after reaching the max extent, the weight is stabilized with a plank or stool, then the kite is depowered, the weight is unhooked and allowed to fall to the ground, and then hooked again for the next powered phase..of course wind speed is a factor.

    If I have a kite for propulsion and I don’t need airconditioning my power needs will be very small. Solar is reliable, simple, quiet, and not very expensive for the amount of power I need. So for a single familly seastead I just don’t see any need to do anything other than solar for electricity. Electricity just does not look like a problem.

    So some new and unproven method of power geneation is not necessary. It is really adding extra risks where we don’t need them. It is kind of fun and interesting. But it does not get us closer to practical seasteads. So my frank opinion is, it can probably be done, but why bother?

    Hmm. I’m not sure electricity will not be an issue, but anyway, it is fun and interesting enough for me to part with $ 150.

    Now propulsion is an issue. We seasteaders think that sacrificing “streamline water shape” in order to get stability and low cost is a good tradeoff. However, we run the risk of having something that will eat too much diesel when we try to move it.

    In this context what do you think about variable geometry seasteads? Basically when we want to move we make the spar horizontal by pumping out water, making it more streamlined.. http://www.seasteading.org/interact/forums/engineering/structure-designs/sparship-2-h-configuration

    #4690
    Profile photo of vincecate
    vincecate
    Participant

    >It’s a deal.

    Cool.

    >If the powered force is 200 lbs, then a 5 gallon bucket will not suffice.

    It is an analog thing, not a binary or on/off thing. I should be able to go between 10 and 50 lbs pull so that pulling up a bucket works out.

    >In this context what do you think about variable geometry seasteads?

    I think I am going to spend like half my time moving. So I want to be very stable and safe when moving. When I am not moving I will probably be in a harbor or sheltered area by being downwind of an island. So I won’t need as much stability when I am not moving. So a design that gives me more stability when I don’t need it and less when I need more stability does not seem to help.

Viewing 15 posts - 46 through 60 (of 66 total)

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