Used Ships

[thebastidgeSubscriber]

300′ Cruise ship/hotel – $200000 (san francisco)

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• Reply to: sale-718155621@craigslist.org
• Date: 2008-06-12, 9:32PM PDT
• 300′ cruise ship with approximately 83 rooms, bar, dance floor, stage, restaurant, needs work, can be moved, steel, generators, lots of space to expand
• Curt 415 531 8546
• Location: san francisco

There’s a lot of used ships listed in various places, some for a few hundred to millions of dollars. I personally see that as an incremental step towards building a Seasteading community that can acheive enough network effect to become viable… Discuss?

[vincecateSubscriber]

I think Alameda paid $200,000 to have that ship “MV Faithful” also known as “Xanadu” halled away for scrap. It was built in 1955. Iron rusts. A bit confused if the old owner still has title or the guy who towed it away can sell it. Not my first choice for being out on the open ocean.

http://sfbay.craigslist.org/sfc/boa/719067244.html

http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_qn4176/is_20080227/ai_n24349627

http://www.maritimematters.com/xanadu1.html

[admiral-dotySubscriber]

It could be purchased for an average of $2410 per room with 83 rooms. If it could be made seaworthy and refurbished for $630,000 that would be $10,000 per room total for single occupancy permanent liveaboard – a bargain. Maybe it could be towed to Mexico to have the work done to save costs, or have enough mechanical work done in SF to move it, then sail under its own power to Mexico for interior restoration and finishing the mechanical work to be seaworthy on the open ocean. I like it!

[thebastidgeSubscriber]

I’m not so interested in a specific at this point, I just think there is potential in what I see listed. A few months ago I saw a wooden-hulled 53″ Norwegian-built fishing vessel from the 1920′s for sale for 8000 bucks, commerically fished no more than 3 years prior, in running condition. I didn’t get a chance to get home and inspect before she sold, but I would have bought her for sure if she had been in the condition her seller represented. She was a government buy-back so had little commercial value (can never be fished again in US waters because the Gov purchased her fishing license back with terms.)

Would have been perfect live-aboard, though a berth in the Columbia close to where I live now would have been a little bit of an issue because she exceeds the common length. I was in a good position to pay cash for purchase and renovation. If I could find something like that again, it would be hard to resist.

[vincecateSubscriber]

If you can get used cruise ships with 250 rooms for $5 mil that is $20,000 per room. Does seem like you might be able to sell rooms at a profit if you used kites to move the ship around. Do it as a condo association or a timeshare property.

http://www.yachtworld.com/core/listing/boatDetails.jsp?&units=Feet&currency=USD&ro=9&r=1365302&rs=yachtworld.com&rt=Motoryacht%20with%20cockpit&boat_id=1365302&checked_boats=1365302&slim=quick&Ntt=cruise&Ntk=boatsEN&sm=3&luom=126&currencyid=100

http://www.yachtworld.com/core/listing/boatDetails.jsp?&units=Feet&currency=USD&ro=3&r=1782962&rs=yachtworld.com&rt=Motoryacht%20with%20cockpit&boat_id=1782962&checked_boats=1782962&slim=quick&Ntt=cruise&Ntk=boatsEN&sm=3&luom=126&currencyid=100

http://wiki.seasteading.org/index.php/User:Vincecate/Migration

[thebastidgeSubscriber]

You’d also have to factor in refit costs, operating costs, and periodic maintenance. $20k per stateroom is not a huge amount considering all the common spaces available, the suport infrastructure etc.

Consider a family of 4 would need 2-3 bedrooms, (I’m assuming an approximation of Western living standards to even be attractive in the first place) and perhaps some more area common to the nuclear or extended family but private outside of that. Such bedrooms need not necessarily be the same size as a land-bound home to have similar quality of life, but would need more efficient use of the cubic.

How you would move around would depend largely on the business model you’re going to use to keep all those people employed. Just aimlessly drifting is almost certainly out, for reasons of maritime law as well as practical concerns. Sailing is not very reliable. Fuel is expensive, and you may not be steaming from place to place all the time, but you need enough for regular movement and a reserve for emergencies. But there is a good reason we don’t see commercial sailing vessels any more. It’s not efficient in terms of commercial operations, where time is money. I have the impression that most sailing vessels are operated by the retired or the idle rich: at least other than mere weekend sailing.

[george.mikalSubscriber]

thanks vincecate for giving links and information

[safiraSubscriber]

Hey folks;

you really need to get realalistic and chill on the dreaming … a boat hull need to be something that needs little attention … so far the best is fiberglass … you can let this go for years at a time with out hauling out to do a bottom job … but if you have a metal or wood hull you need to do a haulout at least every 2 to 3 years … as to the operation and items used onboard subscribe to the K.I.S.S. program. (keep it simple stupid) …

have been doing this for over 10 yrs now and I think the best way to go with the seasteading is a lot of inboats rafting together or to a dock rather than a big boat with a lot of rooms … just a personal preference though …. a large ship with rooms reminds me of the riley the rat syndrome …

cheers

[OCEANOPOLISSubscriber]

http://www.yachtworld.com/boats/1944/Us-Navy–2112610/WA/United-States

[SailorTrashSubscriber]

I’m with Safira. Fiberglass is the way to go. Tough, light, easily repaired, low maintenance.

S/V Sovereign: http://seagypsies-mikeandkatie.blogspot.com/

Taking our cue from the Eskimos, we boat people have over 30 words for “leak.”

[FarmerSubscriber]

This thread typifies the either/or thinking I see a lot of around here.

I know we all want the awesome carbon fiber wonder of the world they do computer graphics of but the reality is more likely to look like a collection of individual efforts: some spar buoy houses, several acres of spiral island a few big boats, floating docks, lots of small boats and some really weird looking stuff no one has guessed at yet.

This is a good thing. If seasteading is all about autonomy, freedom, sovereignty and all that then why would we work years only to create a tiny version of an existing government? That billion dollar an acre megastructure would not allow us any more individual freedom than a a small town somewhere. Coming to a single agreed upon answer is not the answer. Maintaining the flexibility to create and recreate is necessary.

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