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Seasteading Outpost: A Seastead?

Home Forums Community IRL GTGs Seasteading Outpost: A Seastead?

This topic contains 21 replies, has 8 voices, and was last updated by Avatar of i_is_j_smith i_is_j_smith 5 years, 1 month ago.

Viewing 15 posts - 1 through 15 (of 22 total)
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  • #920
    Avatar of OCEANOPOLIS
    OCEANOPOLIS
    Participant

    I would like to introduce the above topic for discussions and feedback. As we all now, the Seasteading Outpost topic was well received and generated a well deserved interest from most of us. Some of us, (including myself) spend a lot of time researching the subject, and coming up w/ideeas and feedback. Pastor Jason initiated the “Belize Outpost”, Dan B looked into the Cayman Island, and others looked into places as far away as Sao Tome, South Pacifc, Guatemala, etc. What were we debating was (and still is), the LOCATION of such Outpost, using basically 2 major criteria: 1) PRICE. 2) P0LITICAL & ECONOMIC FREEDOM. And what we were looking for (and still are), is a piece of real estate to fit this criteria. And the search for it, somehow, took us abroad,…But, what if we are WRONG? What if the first Seasteading Outpost shouldnt be a waterfront property but an ACTUAL SEASTEAD? What if the best place to start is right here in U.S? After all we have the freedom to build any floating structure here for personal use. We have the freedom to launch it, sail it, anchor it in a legal anchorage. We have the freedom to live on it and conduct scientific experiments w/alternative energies and alternative lifestyles. We have the freedom to assemble on it and pack and go whenever we want. What if (and actually is, due to this recession) cheaper and more convenient to start right here, in U.S.? I am proposing 3 location that I know from personal experience, are very suited for an Outpost as a Seastead location here in U.S. in the order from less to most desireble:

    1) San Diego Bay, CA. A bit pricey and a lot of gov interference. Otherwise good anchoring and weather. A boating hub w/good of business potential.

    2) Pamlico Sound, NC. Cheap and almost 0 gov. interference. Cold weather in the winter and wicked, unpredictable in the summer. Decent business potential.

    3)Florida Keys(Key West) FL. Cheap and minimum gov. interference. Very libertarian and open minded. Xcellent anchorages next to the 2rd largest coral reef in the world. Beautifull weather all year round. Xcellent business opportunities.

    #6067
    Avatar of wohl1917
    wohl1917
    Participant

    and would add

    4) The Great Lakes, any of them

    and

    5) Albemarle Sound, NC

    I have a basic and fundamental problem with moving finite resources and people to any other country unless it was my own. ‘They’ don’t really like US out there and tolerate us because we have money. If that were to change for any number of countless reasons a Seastead Outpost in say, Belize, could suddenly be very, very far from home…

    #6069
    Avatar of OCEANOPOLIS
    OCEANOPOLIS
    Participant

    Ty for responding. I dont have a problem w/ moving to another country as long as the seasteading goal is achived. Actually, I do like Belize for an Outpost, specially the cayes on the reef, and plan to go there eventually if Pastor Jason’s plan goes thru. But is good to look @ all the posibilities before making a final decision. Between building a seastead here in U.S.(a small one to start,…up to 100′) and using it as an Outpost or going to Belize and settle down on a tropical beach to build a seastead,….they both sound good to me. The big question is which one is correct, in the long run?

    #6079
    Avatar of Patri
    Patri
    Keymaster

    This is an interesting idea, but doesn’t it somewhat conflict with your point elsewhere about repairs at sea taking 3-4x longer? That is, won’t it be much easier to build seasteads from a base on land?

    We have the freedom to live on it and conduct scientific experiments w/alternative energies

    I’m not so sure about this. The US regulates scientific research and resource extraction, including alt. energy, throughout the EEZ. You can do it, but its regulated and you need permission.

    #6083
    Avatar of OCEANOPOLIS
    OCEANOPOLIS
    Participant

    The whole ideea is to anchor the seastead in the sheltered waters of a bay or a sound. My point elswhere was about building in the middle of the ocean w/rolling sea around,…The seastead will be built on land, close by the desired anchoring location. It should be a small one, max. 100′ LOA, sort of a Seasteading Lab Outpost. What I meant by scientific research was not dissecting the atom:-) or drilling for titanum nodules but research to optimize solar and wind power use on board, electric propulsion systems, hydrogen production for fuel cell use. But mostly I would focus on the social -political aspect. It is a subject that we dont talk to much about. It seems that we think that all we need is a nice, shinny, plushy, all the gadgets aboard, ready to move on seastead, and here we go, sailing into the sunset, no more worries now, brave new worlds. We have to figure it out before anything else, so an Outpost will be a good “ground zero” for that.

    After all, if we fail w/any of the Outpost projects abroad, than all we have left is this one:-)

    #6089
    Avatar of wohl1917
    wohl1917
    Participant

    …don’t tell anyone and just do it! It’s better to ask for forgiveness than to beg for permission in any case. Once you go begging for permission, ‘they’ and ‘them’ know what you’re doing or what you intend to do and can then pick and choose when and where to stop if they don’t just flatly deny you ‘permission’. On the other hand by simply by not saying anything and most importantly keeping a low profile, we could do almost anything. Then, when and if they show up you stand on your rights and hope for the best.

    #6091
    Avatar of Pastor_Jason
    Pastor_Jason
    Participant

    Wohl is right. As long as your activities weren’t “flaunted” or advertised and you kept your vessel moving the likelihood that you’d get tagged by the authorities is pretty low. I don’t think anything Octavian is proposing would be largely regulated… as long as you weren’t growing hydroponic weed you should be fairly safe.

    Live Well!

    -Jason

    #6119
    Avatar of SailorTrash
    SailorTrash
    Participant

    Politically, the Conch Shell Republic would probably be very open to seasteading neighbors. Problem is, it’s right in the barrel of the hurricane shotgun. But that’s an engineering issue, and surmountable, no doubt.

    #6123
    Avatar of OCEANOPOLIS
    OCEANOPOLIS
    Participant

    Key West is maybe the most liberal city in U.S. I’d drop the hook in the lee of the Chrismas Tree island. and make a fortune. By the way, they are looking now for a location for a nude beach. A seastead wolud be perfect in the mentioned location. True about the hurricanes, but if mobile, you can always find a hole on the inside there.

    #6130
    Avatar of SailorTrash
    SailorTrash
    Participant

    Got that right. My wife loves Key West, used to live there. We’ll be throwing the hook there for a while in a year or so.

    #6369
    Avatar of thief
    thief
    Participant

    wohl1917 wrote:

    ‘They’ don’t really like US out there and tolerate us because we have money.

    You might not think of me as one of ‘them’, being from the UK. But we hate America alot more than we let on. But very few of us hate all Americans. We generally hate your government and your stupid people, but we have nothing against your common, intelligent man.

    On the other hand, for a bunch of defectors, I see alot of American patriotism on these boards, which we do tend to dislike.

    But as long as the Stead doesn’t fly the American flag, or even if it flies various flags (according to who’s on board), you shouldn’t have a problem with racism.

    - Nick

    #6372
    Avatar of vincecate
    vincecate
    Participant

    wohl1917 wrote:

    ‘They’ don’t really like US out there and tolerate us because we have money.

    The US dollar holds nearly a monopoly on the international currency market for buying oil, stuff from China, etc. The US is borrowing and printing huge quantities of dollars. These dollars (after changing hands) can then end up buying stuff from all over the world. Over the next 10 years I think other countries will no longer tolerate this strange situation where the US can print money and then use it to buy things from the rest of the world. When printing was done at a sort of moderate rate people tolerated it, but it looks like it will soon be too much. I also don’t think the world will be lending the trillions that the US needs to continue in the lifestyle it has become accustomed to. As the world lends the US less it will have to either cut back government or print more money. A betting man should go with the “print more money” as really cutting government is a very rare thing and a particularly low chance with the current batch of US politicians. As the US prints more, the dollar will depreciate and the rest of the world will trust the US dollar less, and lend the US less, so the US will have to print more. As interest rates and prices will go up, the US deficit will expand even more, resulting in yet more printing of money. At some point no major producers will take US dollars for oil etc. It might happen gradually, but a sudden panic along the way seems probable.

    Anyway, we know the US has enough gold for about $300 billion, or 2 months government deficit. After that, the US only really has monopoly money. If nobody else plays with this monopoly money, the US has a very big problem.

    – Vince

    #6373
    Avatar of thief
    thief
    Participant

    It would be nice to live in a world where countries aren’t so stupid as to throw themselves into inflation like that.

    Or, you know, any world other than this one.

    - Nick

    #6381
    Avatar of vincecate
    vincecate
    Participant

    thief wrote:

    It would be nice to live in a world where countries aren’t so stupid as to throw themselves into inflation like that.

    Yes, countries all over print money and have Inflation. The strange thing is that the US can print money and buy oil. For many years now it is importing real goods and exporting paper with pictures of dead presidents on it. Long term it is crazy for the world to keep taking paper for real stuff. This is amazing, and not going to last forever.

    Another way to look at this. If China has 2 trillion dollars and the US doubles the amount of dollars out there, they more or less steal half the value of the dollars the Chinese had. This ability of the US to levy an “inflation tax” on the central banks around the world holding US dollars (as well as drug dealers with piles of cash) is extraordinary. It will not go on forever.

    #6382
    Avatar of thief
    thief
    Participant

    I would guess that the US can keep using the money it prints because there are so many dollars out there. So when more are printed, even huge amounts, it’s barely a dent on the overall value of the dollar. And so they can keep on printing without worrying about inflation… for now. But I’ve expected to see a huge break in the economic system for a long time now, and honestly I’m glad it’s happening to America. As a country, America seems so sure that it’s better than every other country, it’s a little sickening to me.

    - Nick

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