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idea for pain clinic

Home Forums Community General Chat idea for pain clinic

This topic contains 44 replies, has 10 voices, and was last updated by Profile photo of elspru elspru 3 years, 8 months ago.

Viewing 15 posts - 16 through 30 (of 45 total)
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  • #12798
    Profile photo of TheTimPotter
    TheTimPotter
    Participant

    I love the idea of locating near Florida. I’m sure that no one likes to buy painkillers illegally. I also found a story about an assisted suicide case being overturned in Florida.

    Would this need to be located outside of the EEZ, or just outside the state’s waters?

    #12800
    Profile photo of OCEANOPOLIS
    OCEANOPOLIS
    Participant

    a reason not to put it inside the territorial waters, close to shore, as a legit business, to start with. Keep in mind that located outside the EEZ (200nm offshore) or even outside the territorial waters (12nm) will translate in very high costs of transporting to and from the seastead in both circumstances.

    #12801
    Profile photo of Alan
    Alan
    Participant

    OCEANOPOLIS wrote:
    I don’t see a reason not to put it inside the territorial waters, close to shore, as a legit business, to start with. Keep in mind that located outside the EEZ (200nm offshore) or even outside the territorial waters (12nm) will translate in very high costs of transporting to and from the seastead in both circumstances.

    ???

    No reason to put it offshore at all, then, if we don’t mind being arrested, having our assets seized, and having the clinic shut down for offering medical services not allowed in U.S. territory. It will be cheaper just to rent a storefront in an existing office park.

    Why did you think we wanted to go off shore in the first place?

    Also, a once-a-day ferry service should not be prohibitively expensive. As long as we are significantly cheaper than flying overseas, we should be able to get customers.

    Incidentally, another possibility just came to my attenntion:

    http://www.oprah.com/health/PTSD-and-MDMA-Therapy-Medical-Uses-of-Ecstasy/2

    Please note: if such a clinic opens, it will be important to closely supervise all pharmaceuticals and not allow any trafficking to shore. It is one thing to use these medicines offshore, it is another thing to be accused of smuggling them.

    #12803
    Profile photo of OCEANOPOLIS
    OCEANOPOLIS
    Participant

    Pain clinics ARE legal in the state of Florida, therefore in Florida waters. The ones busted couple of weeks ago MUST have done something illegal!…I know it will be cheaper to rent a storefront, lol. But this was your idea:), not mine. I said that I like it IN CONJUNCTION with other business ventures on the same seastead that provides for the pain clinic, nor neccesarely as a pain clinic alone.

    Now, a “once a day” ferry going 200 nm offsore will be very expensive. Better off get a seaplane or a chopper. If only 12 nm offshore, it’s ok.

    #12804
    Profile photo of tusavision
    tusavision
    Participant

    GET TO THE CHOPPA!

    I like the concept, but going off shore only solves the problem if you’re cutting the doctor out of the loop of making the prescription. Otherwise, they can just revoke the Rx pad.

    If you don’t have a doctor, it’s really just an off-shore opium den, with some pretenses any at all.

    Making a california offshore marijuana nursery would be interesting. The state would leave you alone, and if the feds/coast guard come: you just sink the disposable greenhouse.

    Gets around the semi-sub ban of 2008.

    #12805
    Profile photo of TheTimPotter
    TheTimPotter
    Participant

    Tuvavision…Medicinal Marijuana is legal in California. You can smoke it on the street if you are registered, and if a police officer harasses you he will lose his job.

    A psychiatry center that offers MDMA, LSD-25, Psilobicin, and other potentially therapudic drugs is much more attractive as many of the scheduled drugs in the United States are actually useful to some people. If I knew I were to die in a couple of weeks, or had PTSD, or needed to be psycho analyzed, I could easily see myself paying for a plane ride and a night or two on a yacht. As long as we are tight wads about drugs never leaving the operation there should be no problem

    #12806
    Profile photo of Ken Sims
    Ken Sims
    Keymaster
    TheTimPotter wrote:
    As long as we are tight wads about drugs never leaving the operation there should be no problem

    If patients with chronic pain conditions can’t take the painkillers with them, then you pretty much have to expand to some variant of the hospice aspect that was already mentioned.

    #12807
    Profile photo of TheTimPotter
    TheTimPotter
    Participant

    Ken

    None of those drugs are pain killers. MDMA treats PTSD. Psilobicin (Magic Mushrooms) is good for overcoming the fear of imminent death. LSD-25 is good for treating alcoholism and enhanced psychoanalysis. I agree that a hospice variant is a much better model.

    We need a problem and a treatment that is:

    1) Acute; i.e. we won’t be providing lifelong solutions. The customer doesn’t have to be at the end of their rope, but it must be a pain that we can solve over a weekend, a week, or a month. I’m making an assumption that the potential customer base for someone who can essentially retire on a boat, likely paying out of pocket, is small.

    2) Utilizes a substance or strategy that is illegal in the states (and as much of the rest of the world as possible). Perhaps we could do something cheaper, but it would be far easier to market something that is otherwise unavailable.

    #12808
    Profile photo of TheTimPotter
    TheTimPotter
    Participant

    As a point of interest, the boat used to shelter the pirate radio operators is for sale in St. Maarten, the Adventure. Running a small business out of this boat would draw extra media coverage, although I’m not sure that we would need the help.

    The only problem I see is that it has already sunk in one hurricane, so the question is can we easily avoid a storm with modern forecasting tools?

    #12813
    Profile photo of OCEANOPOLIS
    OCEANOPOLIS
    Participant

    Hurricanes and storms can be easily avoided, specially with the modern sattelite forcasting tools. “Adventure” went down during Hurricane Lenny. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hurricane_Lenny

    While I don’t know the circumstances which lead to the sinking of the “Adventure”, one thing is for sure that it was due to the captain’s poor seamanship, no doubt about it. As you can see here, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Lenny_1999_track.png, there was plenty of warning that Lenny would make landfall somewhere around the Leeward Islands. Any good captain would have sail due south, full speed, a week before landfall. @ 89′ LOA, “Adventure” can easily make 15 knt under power. That’s 1800 nm south of St. Maarten in 5 days. Plenty of ocean to avoid disaster.

    Regardless, she’s got beautiful lines. I love gaff rigged schooners.

    #12816
    Profile photo of
    Anonymous

    That is a nice looking boat. Would it be big enough for these purposes? I could see it doing charters, but it may not be very well suited to having people coming and going to receive treatments. I liek the idea of a clinic. I’m not sure how outside the law you want to go with something of this nature. Going outside of the law to offer treatments that are not otherwise available in the states is a good idea. But you should be warry of going too far outside, and should definitely be careful not to be thought of as “drug traffickers”. Even if you are 200nm out to sea, you have to get back sometime somehow.

    I don’t have anything that I would go to such a clinic for, but I like the idea of it, and you have my supoprt. (not that my support really means anything lol)

    OCEANOPOLIS wrote:

    Hurricanes and storms can be easily avoided, specially with the modern sattelite forcasting tools. “Adventure” went down during Hurricane Lenny. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hurricane_Lenny

    While I don’t know the circumstances which lead to the sinking of the “Adventure”, one thing is for sure that it was due to the captain’s poor seamanship, no doubt about it. As you can see here, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Lenny_1999_track.png, there was plenty of warning that Lenny would make landfall somewhere around the Leeward Islands. Any good captain would have sail due south, full speed, a week before landfall. @ 89′ LOA, “Adventure” can easily make 15 knt under power. That’s 1800 nm south of St. Maarten in 5 days. Plenty of ocean to avoid disaster.

    Regardless, she’s got beautiful lines. I love gaff rigged schooners.

    #12822
    Profile photo of Alan
    Alan
    Participant

    OCEANOPOLIS wrote:
    Pain clinics ARE legal in the state of Florida, therefore in Florida waters. The ones busted couple of weeks ago MUST have done something illegal!

    Um, you haven’t been paying much attention to what’s going on in the US, have you?

    Pain clinics are legal in the USA the same way prostitution is legal in the Vatican – if you include making donations to nuns so they will pray for your soul to be prostitution.

    And because there is always someone who takes things very literally: No, you will not have luck finding prostitutes in the Vatican, and realistic pain treatment is unavailable to many patients with chronic pain in the U.S.A., due to the War on Some Drugs.

    #12823
    Profile photo of TheTimPotter
    TheTimPotter
    Participant

    I counted 4 twin size beds and 1 queen size bed. Definitely on the small side, but I think it could be done. 1 doctor, 2 patients, 2 crew. In a nice climate you can have 1-2 people sleep on the deck in hammocks.

    The idea is to start small, and this costs about as much as opening a subway or mcdonalds. There are other boats to choose from.

    I read somewhere that the carribbean has quite a few decent med schools, we could probably negotiate a good price with someone.

    #12827
    Profile photo of elspru
    elspru
    Participant

    OCEANOPOLIS wrote:

    Elspru.

    We are (or @ least I am) well aware what Big Pharma is doing. Yes, they have everybody by their balls and hanging tight. But obviously, you are young and healthy and you never had anything surgically removed from your body. Because when your apendix is about to burst after you have puked your guts off for 4 hours and the pain is excruciating now, that shot of morphine is God sent, no matter how much the Big Pharma is making out of it. There are no efficient herbs for that situation.

    ummm, yes there are… morphine is derived from the poppy-plant..

    can have the seeds, or make opium from the latex, much easier than morphine extraction…

    I am sure you are skeptical about my statement for now…. But wait until you get older,… and you’ll see. Nobody is imune to that, nobody.

    sorry immune to what? being unaware? …

    well you could simply do some research, there are always ways to improve.

    Tusa.

    What’s a good icebraker? I don’t care either about the PR, especially when being 1500 nm offshore, since nobody on “mainland” will give a flying f… if, lets say, 200 souls will live or die on a seastead. “Do what you want” won’t really cut it out there. I am talking abot a consensus here.

    A good icebreaker could be seasteading nation successfully defends itself from foreign military.

    Before then, it would have to be kind of a whisper in the wind,

    people, refugees, adventurers, going off to join seasteading nations.

    Because the 2 most important resources in the global economy are food and energy. And the demand will continue to increase.Seasteading has plenty of that. It has fish. Food. Limited. And it has wind and sun. Energy. Unlimited. Therefore, unlimited food. The rest of it, it’s just pocket change.

    interesting perspective.

    so we’d have to make greenhouses then, grow our own food on the water.

    calm aware desire choice love express intuit move

    #12830
    Profile photo of OCEANOPOLIS
    OCEANOPOLIS
    Participant

    by “….unlimited food” was that by being able to store and then sell a “byproduct” of an unlimited energy production, a seastead can generate plenty of cash to buy enough food for daily consumtion, somehow indefinitely. And the “byproduct” can be a lot of things, from hydrogen, to drinking water, to extracting uranium from the seawater, to the ability to mine the seabed, etc. The whole comment was geared toward the economic self sustainability of future seasteads. It didn’t neccesarely implied building the whole seastead as a giant greenhouse. I don’t think that it will make any business sense spending $ millions on a seastead and then turning it into a tomato farm :) But I can envision small hydroponic greenhouses able to produce plenty of fresh vegetable that will cover a certain percentage of the local consumption. The rest of the food, will have to be imported. Therefore, seasteads will have to be profitable. In order to do that, seasteads will have to have something to sell, a product or a service, or (better off) both. I don’t see any other way around it.

    Sry to have somewhow hijacked this thread,…but it’s a bit related since a pain clinic can be a service that a seastead can sell. Still, to me, it seems a bit too complicated in terms of the logistics and the high capital involved to make it profitable.

    How about a simple, old fashion fishing business located on a platform offshore, to start with? If you are located 30 nm offshore and 10 guys are fishing dawn to dusk, they got to be catching @ least 300-400 lb. of fish/ day if not much more. @ $3/ lb for a fast sell, it’s around $ 1000 /day. And grow from there, if going offshore is the goal to start with,…

    On a personal not, I have noticed that in the past 2 years since I’ve been around, everybody seems to be so eager to go straight offshore, totally bypassing baysteading or coastalsteading. I am not sure how wise that is. What would be wrong with a 80′ platform, lets say barge like, anchored in sheltered waters close to shore to start with? Or a 80′ used houseboat with rafted up floats around it in the same manner? Not even neccesarely as a business in the beginning. But a place where a group of like minded individuals who share ownership can congregate to plan ahead and exchange ideas on the subject while relaxing and enjoying the sun and the warm water? How hard would that be, to really start with? And wouldn’t that be a small step forward, a presence on the water, instead of just talking about it?

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