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Forum rules and policies

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This topic contains 22 replies, has 7 voices, and was last updated by Profile photo of Ken Sims Ken Sims 3 years, 3 months ago.

Viewing 15 posts - 1 through 15 (of 23 total)
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  • #1630
    Profile photo of elspru
    elspru
    Participant

    As a holographic representation of the law of the sea, we should have forum rules and policies, to help channel interactions to maximize efficinecy, productivity, creativity and community.

    I have some forum experience, with many different forums, and have studied various legal documents, programming paradigms, and belief systems so I’ll start us of with some suggestions. Hopefully various users shall contribute, and we’ll reach a consensus or vote of which rules or policies we like.

    The most fundamental rule is of course the Golden Rule, what you do to we, we do to you.

    0. allow users to do nothing, ignore, hide or withhold information. Interaction with the forums is voluntary, we must respect that, and let people have their privacy or propriety. So if a quesiton has been asked of a specific user, and the user has declined to answer it, then let it go and move on.

    1. allow users to be aware, to read the forums, write in English, use quotes, citations, references, pictures that are relevant to the thread, and contribute to the topic. To minimize scrolling: If you wish to add or modify a previous post, there is an edit feature. Reply to multiple users in a single post.

    2. allow users to desire, to make requests, to answer questions, aspire to goals, and fullfill them. If someone is set on accomplishing a goal, or satisfying a desire, be supportive, or at least neutral. Avoid degradation, judgment, skepticism, pessimism, anger, fear rather cultivate empowerment, acceptance, education, optimism, patience, love.

    3. allow users to choose, to be different, to believe or do otherwise. Can believe in alternative lifestyle, technology, religion or path. Respect what others have chosen to do, if you disagree, can mention your perspective for potential mutual growth, but otherwise live and let live.

    #15511
    Profile photo of shredder7753
    shredder7753
    Participant

    its gonna be really interesting to see how this one turns out. the outside world has read that seasteaders want to build a libertarian utopia with absolutely no rules. none. and we cant even handle a virtual space without rules.

    i just wish we had a ‘walk the plank button’. that way you can click the button any time and once a certain number of users clicks the button, dude just gets toasted. of course, i myself might have walked the plank early on in my tenure when there was friction between me and other users.

    adduno.

    i have seen way too many people get out of line way too much in the last few weeks, so heres my solution.

    everybody, walk the plank! har-d har har!

    psych, lol.

    the way i see it we really did a piss poor job handling a troll (or 2). DNFTT, ever! we ought to just do the silent treatment. that is the rule, from now on. whenever someone gets out of line – silent treatment. that way if they go off and write disparaging remarks continuously it will be WAY easier to single them out and blocking will just be a matter of course.

    Rich

    ____________

    My Work II

    “Leadership and do-ership are not the same thing”

    #15513
    Profile photo of elspru
    elspru
    Participant

    shredder7753 wrote:

    its gonna be really interesting to see how this one turns out. the outside world has read that seasteaders want to build a libertarian utopia with absolutely no rules. none. and we cant even handle a virtual space without rules.

    i just wish we had a ‘walk the plank button’. that way you can click the button any time and once a certain number of users clicks the button, dude just gets toasted.

    Yes, perhaps we could enable a karma feature or plugin on the forums, then can also reward people for good posts. I’ve often been enthused by a post, and wished to star or otherwise reward the user, but we don’t have a rating system in place.

    the way i see it we really did a piss poor job handling a troll (or 2). DNFTT, ever! we ought to just do the silent treatment. that is the rule, from now on. whenever someone gets out of line – silent treatment.

    that’s somewhat hard, considering trolls make their posts precisely so they would ellicit a response.

    that way if they go off and write disparaging remarks continuously it will be WAY easier to single them out and blocking will just be a matter of course.

    Rich

    If someone gets negative karma points, they’ll be able to see how the community feels about them, and perhaps change their behaviour to improve their karma.

    Also if someone has a lot of negative karma, then it lets moderators know that the community is willing to ban that user.

    Admitedly I have a negative karma point on the pirate-party forums, so I’ve become more careful with my phrasing, and make an effort to make happy supportive posts, in the effort to raise my karma back up. I did get a positive karma point to neutral, it’s negative now again, though I’m not sure from what, it would be good to have a listing of which posts got karma points, so users can review what they can avoid and what they can elaborate on.

    calm aware desire choice love express intuit move

    #15515
    Profile photo of wohl1917
    wohl1917
    Participant

    Rant for everyone in general but Ken and Elspru in particullar: For people who claim to be Libertairians, who claim believe in the Four Freedom and Self Determination Y’all are damn quick to suggest ‘baning’ and ‘blocking’ people who aren’t any more or less offensive than anyone else on here has been: I mean COME ON PEOPLE!!! Seriously, if spewing out nonsencical crazy speak was grounds for baning or blocking anyone, Elspru, you new-born hollier than thou karma facist, you’d be LONG GONE!!! Utter new age commu-nazi drivel!!! Ken, damn man! Quit blocking people! Hell, if they wright posts that read like Reservoir Dogs on streoids with no useful content or redeaming point, OK, fine. If they’re Bots or trying to hard sell crap, OK, fine. But to ban/block people for not reading back threads? COME ON!!!

    Hear, Hear Shredder!

    < http://ocr.wikia.com/wiki/Oceanic_Citizens_Republic_Wiki>

    Profile photo of Ken Sims
    Ken Sims
    Keymaster
    elspru wrote:
    shredder7753 wrote:

    i just wish we had a ‘walk the plank button’. that way you can click the button any time and once a certain number of users clicks the button, dude just gets toasted.

    Yes, perhaps we could enable a karma feature or plugin on the forums, then can also reward people for good posts. I’ve often been enthused by a post, and wished to star or otherwise reward the user, but we don’t have a rating system in place.

    If someone gets negative karma points, they’ll be able to see how the community feels about them, and perhaps change their behaviour to improve their karma.

    Also if someone has a lot of negative karma, then it lets moderators know that the community is willing to ban that user.

    [/quote]

    I’ve was thinking about this after I blocked Capt.Sean and made my post to that effect.

    TSi has already said that they aren’t going to provide a moderator. I really doubt that we are going to get a volunteer moderator team. So it’s likely we’ll end up with Wild, Wild West mode by default.

    I’m pretty sure that there is nothing currently installed to do anything like a karma button. While it’s possible that is some Drupal module to do something like that, it might not supported for our way-old version of Drupal, plus I don’t have the capability to install Drupal modules anyway. So I think that you can discount any system-based way of keeping any kind of score.

    But since I’ll still be retaining all of my system authorities for spamfighting and admin purposes …

    If a big o’ enough of posse brings in some varmint hog-tied and wants him tarred-and-feathers (temporarily blocked) or run out of town on a rail (permanently blocked), I’ll oblige.

    You all would be the moderators and my implementing of the block would more an admin kind of thing than a moderator kind of thing.

    Ken

    #15517

    Hello wohl, nice rant, – i think the basic problem is that you can not have both – smart people who have educated talks about themes of interest – and wild posts spreading out calumny insults etc… you have to take a decision you stay with the educated people and the well placed arguments, or you stay with the nutbags killing the forum beyond worth reading for anyone.

    It is not a “libertarian political question” it is a practical question.

    If you leave it to “self regulate” it will self regulate in that way that the agressive nutbags that respect nobody will take over all forums and fill all spaces, and the smart and decent people bringing info and good arguments will go away to have their scientific discussion process somewhere else – free of nutbag interference -

    Is that what you propose as the “future of the seasteading forums”?

    Wil

    concretesubmarine.com

    #15518
    Profile photo of Ken Sims
    Ken Sims
    Keymaster
    wohl1917 wrote:
    Ken, damn man! Quit blocking people! Hell, if they wright posts that read like Reservoir Dogs on streoids with no useful content or redeaming point, OK, fine. If they’re Bots or trying to hard sell crap, OK, fine. But to ban/block people for not reading back threads? COME ON!!!

    I didn’t block Capt.Sean for not reading past threads. If you would have read my post rather than what someone else said about it, you’d know that.

    I blocked Capt.Sean because he was cluttering up the forums with many, many posts, none of which contained anything positive or anything useful. In addition, he was frequently insulting to anyone who didn’t agree with him. The last straw was his statement that emmettvm was the one in danger of being blocked.

    Once we are [presumably] in Wild, Wild West mode, he’ll be unblocked (unless the group wants to exercise the run-out-of-town-on-a-rail option).

    Ken

    #15519

    As it looks that drupal will not solve the problem of interuptive nutbags with a technical solution we might simply start to develop a civic discussion culture that includes a social walk the plank process instead of a technical one (block).

    The simplest form would be that everybody who sees himself bothered by a behavior does EXPRESS this on the forum with a short polite message. I suggest comments like.

    …please don’t clutter this forum….

    …agression in posts is not welcome on this forum…

    …please read the provided links….

    …please use the search function…

    The problem is that if that kind of comment comes from just ONE member it fregently triggers a “attack mode” from the clutterer doing even more forum cluttering. So to be effective it must come from several different posters to have a social walk the plank quality.

    What happens is that we have to build a working society and a working come together process on the forums to create a movement – it is a nice exercise to do in internet before we try to do it at sea as a seasteading community.

    Wil

    concretesubmarine.com

    #15523
    Profile photo of Ken Sims
    Ken Sims
    Keymaster
    ellmer - http://yook3.com wrote:

    As it looks that drupal will not solve the problem of interuptive nutbags with a technical solution we might simply start to develop a civic discussion culture that includes a social walk the plank process instead of a technical one (block).

    Certainly what you’ve went on to describe should be attempted before any blocking is done. That’s why even if there was some kind of scoring system, I wouldn’t want that system to auto-block anybody.

    If someone has a genuine interest in seasteading, we want to try to integrate them into the community, preferably without the need for even a temporary block.

    But a temporary block may be appropriate for a cooling down period (primarily for the person in question, but also for the group).

    If the person is persistent in being disruptive, then a permanent block becomes necessary to protect the integrity of the forums. Generally the person would be given a chance to speak on their own behalf before a permanent block is implemented.

    Edited to add: That last sentence is applicable only where there are no official moderator(s) and the group is making an appeal to me for a permanent block. If there are official moderator(s), they would apply their own procedures for determining whether a user should be temporarily blocked (and if so, for how long) or permanently blocked.

    Ken

    #15527
    Profile photo of
    Anonymous

    wohl1917 wrote:

    ….nonsencical crazy speak….

    tee hee :D

    #15530
    Profile photo of shredder7753
    shredder7753
    Participant

    emmettvm wrote:

    wohl1917 wrote:

    ….nonsencical crazy speak….

    tee hee :D

    [/quote]

    i was thinkin that too. takin us back, Mr. Wohlwend – lol!

    ____________

    My Work II

    “Leadership and do-ership are not the same thing”

    #15531
    Profile photo of elspru
    elspru
    Participant

    wohl1917 wrote:

    Rant for everyone in general but Ken and Elspru in particullar: For people who claim to be Libertairians, who claim believe in the Four Freedom

    coincidentally there are Four rules, policies or Freedoms I listed, curious.

    and Self Determination Y’all are damn quick to suggest ‘baning’ and ‘blocking’ people who aren’t any more or less offensive than anyone else on here has been: I mean COME ON PEOPLE!!! Seriously, if spewing out nonsencical crazy speak was grounds for baning or blocking anyone,

    actually “spewing” new information is protected by rule 3. choice and alternative beliefs.

    Elspru, you new-born hollier than thou karma facist, you’d be LONG GONE!!! Utter new age commu-nazi drivel!!!

    this is precisely why I made this ruleset,

    I figured that if we let some higher-ups do it,

    they might not make rules that we like or agree with.

    If we get a head-start on the process, and can show we can govern ourselves effectively, safely and preferably beneficially, then we’d be allowed to go on doing as we do, using the rules or policies we have accepted.

    In fact, this ruleset would technically allow people to talk about alternative technologies, and even life-forms, as it’s simply an alternative world-view, beliefs that at least some users can agree with and find beneficial.

    calm aware desire choice love express intuit move

    #15536
    Profile photo of wohl1917
    wohl1917
    Participant

    Calm, aware, desire, choice, love, express, intuit, move… If you read that several times it has the same calming effect of reading, om mane padme om….

    < http://ocr.wikia.com/wiki/Oceanic_Citizens_Republic_Wiki>

    Profile photo of i_is_j_smith
    i_is_j_smith
    Participant

    I don’t know, I’m worried that any formula elspru comes up with to moderate the forums will have chakras involved…

    #15544
    Profile photo of Ken Sims
    Ken Sims
    Keymaster

    With Randy back in the office on Monday, I received an email from him late last night in response to the email that I sent after locking the Space Habitation thread.

    I mentioned in the email about forbidding certain topics, but at that point did not ask for a ruling. (That was before the whole “corruption” thread thing.)

    His response did not directly address the issue of forbidden topics. Mostly it just acknowledged what I had done.

    The one thing of interest … even though I had not blocked anyone from that whole mess, Randy did say,

    I have NO PROBLEM with you banning people who distract from the fundamental reason that we have the forums: to encourage practical seasteading.

    That’s kind of implicit agreement with my ruling about forbidden topics, but I have asked explicitly.

    I sent a big ol’ email to Randy and Michael bringing them up-to-date what’s been happening since the Space Habitation thread, including the semi-permanent blocks of Sickor and Dervogel707, and the temporary block of Capt.Sean.

    I gave them links to several threads, but specifically asked that they read in their entirety the “corruption” thread and this thread.

    I asked for an official ruling about forbidden topics as I had said in the corruption thread that I would.

    I also presented the four options that I see for the forums and asked for an official decision. (This is why I added Michael [President of TSI] on this email.)

    1. TSI Staff moderator(s).
    2. Volunteer moderator(s) who would be specifically for moderation of user discussions.
    3. Shut down the forums.
    4. Wild, Wild West mode.

    I also told them that option 4 is the default. That I’m going to stop doing any moderation of user discussions probably on Saturday, and option 4 will kick in by default.

    I did mention to them, as I had previously mentioned here, that if there is a large enough group that wants someone blocked temporarily or permanently, I’ll do that if warranted.

    So I don’t know what’s going to happen, but if I were making a bet, I’d lay my wager on option 4.

    Ken

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