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deep sea seasteading VENT BASE ALPHA

Home Forums Archive Structure Designs deep sea seasteading VENT BASE ALPHA

This topic contains 22 replies, has 10 voices, and was last updated by Avatar of oobi oobi 3 years, 5 months ago.

Viewing 8 posts - 16 through 23 (of 23 total)
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  • #12199
    Avatar of tusavision
    tusavision
    Participant

    OCEANOPOLIS wrote:

    Why would you LOVE robots? All they do is take jobs from humans. Because of that, millions of children are straving and dying as we speak.

    Not to hijack the thread but:

    http://www.marshallbrain.com/manna1.htm

    Moderator’s Note: I agree with Wil that this should be a thread of its own. Unfortunately the forum software does not support splitting threads, so I’ve manually started a new thread.

    Please discuss here:
    http://seasteading.org/interact/forums/engineering/structure-designs/computers-managing-humans
    Thanks.
    Ken

    #12200

    tusavision wrote:

    http://www.marshallbrain.com/manna1.htm

    Very interesting reading !!! – Given the goals of TSI this deserves AT LEAST a own thread and a deeper discussion. Baseline is – all those things will happen (sooner than most of us expect) may we like it or not – Question is – are we part of the problem or part of the solution…please open a thread on this (reading of above novel as a base condition for discussion) – ( vent base alpha thread is probably not a good place to handle that theme).

    Wil

    #12196

    ssteve wrote:

    ….guess would be that you would need to sell thousands of tons of recovered materials to make the whole project economically viable…

    It looks like the lifting of materials could be done by a riser pipe.

    And mininig tools could be remote controlled machinery that is already used in digging trenches for oil/gas industy pipelines. So no real engineering leap would be required. A faforable feature seems to be a unlimited energy source in form of easy available geothermal energy. So processing and refining of minerals on the spot without moving tons of materials to the surface could be a realistic option. Other than in land based mining there is no difficulty to bring in equipment that weights thousands of tons. Floating factories like LNG plants are working already many miles off shore.

    Wil

    concretesubmarine.com

    European Submarine Structures AB

    #12204

    …..The Chinese government has just lodged the first application to mine for minerals under the seabed in international waters, in this case on a ridge in the Indian Ocean 1,700 metres (more than 5,000ft) below the surface.

    The Chinese are hoping to recover valuable metals such as copper, nickel and cobalt – used in mobile phones, laptops and batteries – as well as gold and silver, in an area of currently inactive “hydrothermal vents”, underwater geysers driven by volcanic activity.

    Some of the vents, known as “black smokers”, are black chimney-like structures which shelter their own ecosystems of little-known creatures, while emitting a cloud of hot, black material containing high levels of sulphur-bearing minerals, or sulphides.

    Having explored the area using remotely operated underwater vehicles, the Chinese want to mine the sulphide deposits of a region of seabed in the south-west Indian Ocean for the rich mineral ores they contain. They have already applied to do so to the International Seabed Authority (ISA), the Jamaica-based body set up under the 1982 UN Convention on The Law of the Sea to deal with the liabilities relating to seabed exploitation and the environmental damage it may cause….

    source THE INDEPENDENT

    —————————-

    ….Deep-sea hydrothermal vent systems are attracting considerable interest from commercial mining companies. Vent systems precipitate seafloor massive sulfide (SMS) deposits that are rich in copper, gold, silver, and zinc. Although commercial firms are targeting inactive SMS deposits, these deposits are so little studied that it is unknown whether they harbor unique species or ecosystems. .. read here

    —————————

    No doubth the business in mid ocean is on….

    How will the people live there ? Shore transport in Helicopter as standard in the oil/gas industry will not happen – does TSI have a proposal – or a serious discussion going on ?

    How to create living space near a mid ocean ridge ? weather exposed platforms? – submerged concrete shells? – What about a autonomous submarine for exploring those resources in first place?

    Let me hear your thoughts…

    Wil

    concretesubmarine.com

    European Submarine Structures AB

    #12209
    Avatar of tusavision
    tusavision
    Participant

    …..The Chinese government has just lodged the first application to mine for minerals under the seabed in international waters, in this case on a ridge in the Indian Ocean 1,700 metres (more than 5,000ft) below the surface.

    The Chinese are hoping to recover valuable metals such as copper, nickel and cobalt – used in mobile phones, laptops and batteries – as well as gold and silver, in an area of currently inactive “hydrothermal vents”, underwater geysers driven by volcanic activity.

    Some of the vents, known as “black smokers”, are black chimney-like structures which shelter their own ecosystems of little-known creatures, while emitting a cloud of hot, black material containing high levels of sulphur-bearing minerals, or sulphides.

    Having explored the area using remotely operated underwater vehicles, the Chinese want to mine the sulphide deposits of a region of seabed in the south-west Indian Ocean for the rich mineral ores they contain. They have already applied to do so to the International Seabed Authority (ISA), the Jamaica-based body set up under the 1982 UN Convention on The Law of the Sea to deal with the liabilities relating to seabed exploitation and the environmental damage it may cause….

    source THE INDEPENDENT

    —————————-

    ….Deep-sea hydrothermal vent systems are attracting considerable interest from commercial mining companies. Vent systems precipitate seafloor massive sulfide (SMS) deposits that are rich in copper, gold, silver, and zinc. Although commercial firms are targeting inactive SMS deposits, these deposits are so little studied that it is unknown whether they harbor unique species or ecosystems. .. read here

    —————————

    No doubth the business in mid ocean is on….

    How will the people live there ? Shore transport in Helicopter as standard in the oil/gas industry will not happen – does TSI have a proposal – or a serious discussion going on ?

    How to create living space near a mid ocean ridge ? weather exposed platforms? – submerged concrete shells? – What about a autonomous submarine for exploring those resources in first place?

    Let me hear your thoughts…

    Wil

    concretesubmarine.com

    European Submarine Structures AB

    What I find interesting is that we are observing the fallacy of the rational market theory in action.

    The cost estimate models used to judge the profitability of these minerals are based on market prices for deep sea mining operations, however the entire purpose of this forum seems to be to identify markets for the technology necessary to conduct deep sea mining operations.

    Deep sea mining says: it’s cost prohibitive, the technology does not exist.

    Seasteading says: inventing the technology is a prohibitive risk, the market does not exist.

    It’s a mexican standoff of capital investment, except the obvious answer is that seasteading should go first and take the leap of faith.

    Why? Because 70% of the earth is covered in water. I don’t believe for one second that 70% of the planet in practically virgin condition, untapped for it’s mineral wealth doesn’t present viable market opportunities given lower cost, flexible ocean living habitats.

    #12210
    Avatar of admiral-doty
    admiral-doty
    Participant

    Instead of developing a capital intensive, high risk business, Seasteading can build the hotels to service the business. This is like building the hotel, restaurants, retail, and other attractions across from the theme park to capitalize on the traffic going to the main attraction without having to invest the large sums of money to build it. This approach could start in the Gulf of Mexico to service the oil platforms. Offer cheap and convenient transportation to and from the rigs along with a nice local destination. Crews usually work in 2 or 3 week shifts with shore time. They might like a nice local destination for the evening instead.

    #12216
    Avatar of LoboSolo
    LoboSolo
    Participant

    Jack wrote:

    I realy think that mining at sea is going to cause some REAL friction with coastal states, i know your talking about the middle of the atlantic or pacific, but Politicians are nothing but arrogant control freaks.

    They will take it badly, even if you have a good reason & they are wrong, remember “Might is Right” when it comes to politics. Justice, & Law are tools, or malleable obstacles, not somthing they take to heart, or as applying to them. (Such as Honor & Chivalry, to knights, simply a tool not somthing to live by or take to heart).

    The most consistent way ive found of predicting the motives & actions of such unfortunate creatures, is to think of them as Feudal Knights or lords of old, since reperesentation is little more than feudal warfare without the swords & castles.

    We are realy going to have to protect our interests some how.

    I think an ROV is the answer to, but maybe a conrete one big one, that sits over the site to extract what we need.

    The real friction will come from others who will try to mine in the same area. Right now … basically no one is doing it because of the expense and legal uncertainties. The UN would be jumping up and down mad because it thinks that it has jurisdiction but it wouldn’t be the real threat.

    I don’t think you’d see the US or any maritime power put a torpedo thru the settlement. Could you imagine how that would play out on TV?

    #12376
    Avatar of oobi
    oobi
    Participant

    Deep sea mining will be one of the activities involve in seasteading. I think the goal with seasteading is not seasteading itself nor to make seasteading profitable. It is to create a paradigm where humanity can become better tenants of the earth by cooperation and eliminating too much competition games leading to domination and wars. By doing so, humanity can succeed to be tenants on some other planets also.

    But, yes mining responsibly will be good. As to make seasteading more feasible these are my ideas: http://bvent.blogspot.com/2011/01/soft-reboot-seasteading.html

Viewing 8 posts - 16 through 23 (of 23 total)

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