October 8, 2009 at 11:59 pm #8058
Even outside the EEZ, in international waters, dealing w/ drugs is problematic. This is from UNCLOS:
Illicit traffic in narcotic drugs or psychotropic substances
1. All States shall cooperate in the suppression of illicit traffic in narcotic drugs and psychotropic substances engaged in by ships on the high seas contrary to international conventions.
2. Any State which has reasonable grounds for believing that a ship flying its flag is engaged in illicit traffic in narcotic drugs or psychotropic substances may request the cooperation of other States to suppress such traffic.
I can see how this article can be interpreted in different ways by different states, if a seastead, flying its own flag on the high sea will decriminalize drug use. It seems to me that the only safe alternative is to grow/produce these drugs on the seastead, for internal use or sale, thus eliminating any posibility of being labeled as involved in “illicit traffic in narcotic drugs”,…Any oppinions?October 9, 2009 at 2:02 am #8060
I’m no expert in this line of conversation, but I’ll give my view as I best understand what I’ve researched.
As far as Article 108 or any article of the UNCLOS goes, it only applies to nation states that have agreed to it, signed and ratified it. Countries that have done this now have a responsibility to follow this law. Now if that means suppression of illicit traffic in narcotic drugs, ect. by ships on the high seas, then I’m pretty sure they better make sure they are doing it to a ship that flies the flag of a fellow country that signed the treaty. If not, then I think it can cause what they call a diplomatic problem.
Only 158 countries have joined the UNCLOS. The U.S signed but has yet to ratify the UNCLOS. Yes, that means that for the time being, the U.S. can ignore all that the UNCLOS has to say. Hillary Clinton has vowed as Secretary of State to get if ratified during her stay though.
So basically, if you fly a flag of convenience by a country that has yet to join the UNCLOS, Then you can’t be touched for the illicit drug yada, yada, crap unless the country that tried to stop you wants to start problems with the country you are flagged under. And of course, as long as the country that is allowing you to fly their flag also doesn’t care about the, according to the UN, “illicit” activity.
I’m sorry, but as my view sees it, I don’t follow all those people that cry UNCLOS with every problem that arises. IT ISN’T THE ABSOLUTE LAW OF THE SEA!! There are ways of getting around having to follow it. As a matter of fact, if you get your seastead as a recognized nation-state by another, then you really don’t have to join the UN if you don’t want to. You have precedence as being a recognized nation-state, and thus do not have to follow any international conventions or treaties as establish among current UN members. Remember, you have a right to exist and lay claim to your own state-hood. And I have a very high suspicion that the UN might find it in their best interest to not try and mess with you too much, or they may get some negative publicity that they probably prefer not get. Besides, they have bigger fish to fry like taking care of dictators that kill thousands if not millions of their citizens, or countries that are making nukes. I doubt they want to go through the trouble of trying to impress upon your nation-state their “league’s” laws, which you do not recognize or follow as law. The UN, after all, isn’t a nation-state of it own, so what diplomatic precedence is there that says you have to recognize anything they have established or have to say in their first place.
So let me have it. I opened up the can of worms. Let me know how my view is flawed. I would appreciate being led into the right “lawful” direction, or just others’ interpretation as they see it, would be great too. And before someone says get back on topic, I think this goes hand in hand when discussing copyright laws, or any laws as far as that goes.October 9, 2009 at 2:12 am #8061
You are right Ocean about not being able to get pinned for trafficking if you grow and use the “illicit” product on your seastead since it didn’t go anywhere.October 9, 2009 at 11:42 pm #8094
Realisticly speaking, whether you follow certain copyrights or not really differs according to location & situation etc. It is not illegal for you to commercially use anything copyrighted elsewhere since your nation will be nothing but a micronation thus you will be out of jurisdiction of such laws as long as you are outside to territorial boundries of any country.But this is a double edged sword, lets see netherlands gets a great revenue from the servers they rent to upload&download companies, U.S has a good revenue from Entertainment such as movies, Britain has an insane revenue from educational products… In a seastead nation you can give these services far cheaper than the original owners of the products, lets say, selling download links, pirate hi-quality pdf files ready to print, pirate movies n such. As long as you have the hdds(your archives) in seastead its almost impossible if possible to stop your broadcast. Problem is turning the e-cash to real currency(it would be really long to explain why). Another problem is ‘will people watch without interfering as you become a billionairre since they cant do anything legally?’ i dont think that will ever happen, for example if you actually manage to destroy britains monopoly over neglish language educational materials that will certainly result in a military intervention, even companies might intervene by using mercanaries or pirates, for example xns plans to build xns land south of sri lanka in the middle of indian ocean, it is for sure the best point possible since it will be the most active maritime trade route in the near future, but also it is a dangerous location, to west lies southern arabia, to east lies endonesia and malaysia these regions are crawling with pirates, and middle east and southwestern asia is crawling with mercenary companies. It may sound like fiction to some of you but simply speaking this methods may sometimes be necessary in business world and it is a fact. Shortly you must be concious of your copyright abuse or it will certainly result in a catastrophe unless pirate party manages to win election in some countries (pirate party: a new political group who are trying to make reforms on copyright laws, officially active in sweeden and trying to expand its activities to many nations, even in my country, Turkey; they offically started in august, though their succes is predicted to be impossible in near future) As for our friends problem no one can do anything about what you broadcast in your cafe even if you charge people for it, why? cos i know many people who work under microsoft and bsa (bsa: an organization in Turkey to fight pirate software) and i dont think they will actually bust a seastead for such thing even if they did they dont have jurisdiction over your actions concerning pirate media. Most probably they will be the ones who will be seen as criminals, since they actually invaded your land with some stupid paperwork which has no use in high seas. Seastead courts should deal with them accordingly, charge them fee or confine them since they most probably busted the stead without passportsOctober 9, 2009 at 11:54 pm #8095
I thought u had a plan to make a dutch cafe on a sea stead sorry for writing all that needless stuff… In many countries it is a crime if you have pirate cd in your possesion…watching it isnt a crime having the data storage device which contains the pirate media is… thus if you have a pirate cd,dvd or such or have an unlicensed software in your usb, hdd… They can hurt you for that, ive been hurt cos of that before (i m running a netcafe&cafe) and Turkey isnt a country who takes pirate sector seriously still i was almost fined (like 4k $.) a little bribe solved the problem though, got to love Turkey Good way to get protection is using virtual operating systems if you are using pirate media often (specially software meant to be used for enterprises) pm me for further info about virtual operating systems if you like…
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