Topic: $10,000 Seastead

$10,000 Seastead

This topic contains 31 replies, has 1 voice, and was last updated by shredder7753 2 years, 3 months ago.

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February 8, 2011 at 8:20 am #1450

tusavision
Subscriber

shredder7753 wrote:

tusavision wrote:

shredder7753 wrote:

man i really didnt want to engage u anymore but… ur so full of it. you cant even do one thing for $10K. i will worship the water you ‘stead on if you can explain how to get ur lil doggies to stay put in the same place for 2 months. DP and mooring cant be done for 10k.

So is what you’re saying is: you concede that you can’t do it for $100,000 dollars and you accept my challenge?

[/quote]

absolutely. bring it.

[/quote]

1)Structure

Concrete Platform

200^2 ft =3.14r^2 -> circle with <9' radius.

<9' radius circle 1' deep= 200 cubic ft of concrete

unit conversion: 1yard^3=27ft^3

200/27-> 7.4 cubic yards of concrete.

Concrete Pricing: (reference source #1)

Price of concrete: $75/cubic yard

Price of Subbase: $12/cubic yard

Price of Forms: $1.50/sq. ft = $300

Price of Reinforcement: $.1/sq. ft = $20

7.4*75=$555

Conclusion:

1′X9′(radius) concrete platform

Price of materials ->$663

Price of Labor -> $300

Total: $963

ETFE Bubble Dome:

Surface area of a 9′ radius sphere=4*3.14*9^2= 1020sq./ft

Surface area of a 9′ radius hemisphere = 1/2*1020=510sq./ft

Theoretical ETFE sheet pricing: $.05sq./ft (reference source #2)

510*.05=$26 (no scrap price)

Conclusion:

510sq/ft ETFE plastic sheet=$26

Conservative Figure ETFE Bubble Dome:

ETFE Sheet Pricing(reference source #3)

12′x12′=$471.65

12×12=144sq./ft

510/144=4

4*471.65=$1900

Conclusion:

510sq/ft ETFE plastic sheet=$1900

2) Equipment

Life Support

Scuba Compressor: $3,154.95 (reference source #4)note: I wouldn’t actually spend this much but for argument sake I’ll pretend I’m this bad at cutting costs.

Volume of seastead = 4/3*3.14*9^3 = 3060 cubic feet

Human consumption of air=60 liters/minute (reference source #5)

Unit Conversion1 liter= .0354ft cubic feet

60*.0354 = 2.12 cubic feet / minute

3060/2=1530 cubic feet per dog

1530/2.12=720 minutes of breathable air per dog

720/60=12 hours breathable air per dog.

The longest lasting hurricane on record lasted 28 days.(reference source #6)

That translates to 56 times our seastead’s capacity. Any sane person would at this point do something simple like:

-move their seastead to a location less hurricane prone

-rate the seastead as a storm shelter to a limited time span.

[text editor is bugging out continuing in next post]

reference sources

#1 http://www.concretenetwork.com/concrete-prices.html

#2 http://nextbigfuture.com/2010/08/geodesic-domes-and-efte-pricing.html

#3 http://www.professionalplastics.com/TEFZEL-ETFESHEETSRODS

#4 http://www.scuba.com/scuba-gear-155/030405/Max-Air-Max-Air-35-Standard-Scuba-Compressor.html

#5 http://www.arb.ca.gov/research/resnotes/notes/94-11.htm

#6 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/North_Atlantic_tropical_cyclone

February 8, 2011 at 9:54 am #12545

tusavision
Subscriber

~~continued from last post:~~

~~That would make sense, but I’m so awesome I don’t have to play by the rules of sane people.~~

Every 10 meters of depth in water adds 1 atmosphere to ambient pressure. By using high pressure hose and a SCUBA regulator, I can store air at a pressure of 3000 PSI above ambient. pnuematic hose and a SCUBA regulator, I can store air at 200 PSI above ambient pressure.

~~We need to fit 56 units of gas in X units volume. Given a value of 56*3060(2 dogs worth) we have to store 171360 cubic feet of gas.~~

If we had higher pressure equipment, we could store this gas at any depth, but because we are artificially limiting ourselves to off the shelf SCUBA/welding gear: 3000 psi pressure differential it is. 200 psi pressure differential it is.

~~200psi =14 ATM or 140 meters worth of pressure differential~~

~~(Original volume / # of ATM) gives us change in volume.~~

~~171360/14= 12240 cubic feet~~

~~So, at 140 meters pressure differential we need a 12240 cubic foot capacity bagpipe in order to store 28 days worth of air.~~

~~As we remember from our earlier post, volume of a sphere is equal to “4/3*3.14*x^3 = 700 cubic feet ” or X^3=167.2~~

~~167.2^-3=5.6 feet radius sphere~~

~~Hefty trash bag= 30 gallons~~

~~1 gallon = .134 cubic feet~~

~~30*.134= 4. cubic feet.~~

700/4=176* 30 gallon bags

~~Hefty 30 gallon bags=$12/40 count(reference #7)~~

~~176/40=4.4~~

~~4.4*12=$53~~

~~Conclusion:~~

~~28 days worth of trashbags: $60~~

~~Continued in next post…~~

~~Reference sources~~

#7 ~~http://www.amazon.com/Hefty-E2-7744-Count-Gallon-Trash/dp/B00467EDBA~~

February 8, 2011 at 10:11 am #12546

tusavision
Subscriber

330 ft=10atm

171360/10=17136 cubic ft of air

17136/4=4284 trash bags

4284/40=108 boxes of trash bags

$1285.2 spent on 4290 trash bags full of air.

330ft of 200 psi airhose

350/50ft=7 airhoses

$20/50 ft of air hose

$140 on air hose.

Total money spent on 28 day air storage/snorkel system $1330

February 8, 2011 at 10:13 am #12547

tusavision
Subscriber

tusavision wrote:

330 ft=10atm

171360/10=17136 cubic ft of air

17136/4=4284 trash bags

4284/40=108 boxes of trash bags

$1285.2 spent on 4290 trash bags full of air.

330ft of 200 psi airhose

350/50ft=7 airhoses

$20/50 ft of air hose

$140 on air hose.

Total money spent on 28 day air storage/snorkel system $1330

I’ll finish it tomorrow. I still have to design the solar/wind/water/wave water systems, and design a diesel fuel tank. Once I have a bill of materials I’ll write the Operational Procedures the ship will follow to keep the dogs alive for 2 months.

February 8, 2011 at 1:30 pm #12549

shredder7753
Subscriber

interesting, so far. holding further comments.

February 8, 2011 at 3:42 pm #12551

elspru
Subscriber

tusavision wrote:

tusavision wrote:

330 ft=10atm

171360/10=17136 cubic ft of air

17136/4=4284 trash bags

4284/40=108 boxes of trash bags

$1285.2 spent on 4290 trash bags full of air.

330ft of 200 psi airhose

350/50ft=7 airhoses

$20/50 ft of air hose

$140 on air hose.

Total money spent on 28 day air storage/snorkel system $1330

I’ll finish it tomorrow. I still have to design the solar/wind/water/wave water systems, and design a diesel fuel tank. Once I have a bill of materials I’ll write the Operational Procedures the ship will follow to keep the dogs alive for 2 months.

[/quote]

Hey, you can save yourself a lot of headache by simply using a biological air-support system.

Nature has been here to provide air for billions upon billions of years.

Probably cost you under $500 in total, for infinity high quality air.

http://www.seasteading.org/interact/forums/engineering/infrastructure/submarine-oxygen-supply

calm aware desire choice love express intuit move

February 8, 2011 at 4:41 pm #12557

OCEANOPOLIS
Subscriber

Is this a $10,000.00 substead for dogs?

February 8, 2011 at 5:11 pm #12559

TheTimPotter
Subscriber

Trash bags?

February 8, 2011 at 7:21 pm #12571

shredder7753
Subscriber

answer the fucking QUESTION tusa!

February 8, 2011 at 7:27 pm #12572

OCEANOPOLIS
Subscriber

the trash bags are for the dog poop ?

February 8, 2011 at 7:28 pm #12567

tusavision
Subscriber

Price of Ammonium Nitrate $934.12/ton (reference source #8)

NH4NO3(s) —–>N2O(g) +2H2O(L) (reference source #9)

Moles N2O = 35 g / 44 g/mol= 0.795
the ratio is 1 : 1
Moles NH4NO3 needed = 0.795
Mass NH4NO3 = 0.795 mol x 80 g/mol= 63.6 g of NH4NO3 required to produce 35g of N2O

Catalytic Decomposition of Nitrous Oxide

activation energy: 1000°C(thermal) >200°C(catalytic)

reaction enthalpy: 82kJ/Mol

reaction temperature: 1300 °C (reference source #10)

2N2O(g) —> 2N2(g) + O2(g) + Heat (reference source #11)

97.7°F = Critical Temperature of N2O (reference source #12)

1069-1278 psi = Critical Pressure of N2O

Density(liquid @ 86°F) = 39.1 lb/cubic feet

Water Capacity of a AL80 SCUBA tank: 678 Cubic Inches(0.392361 ft³)

15.34lbs N20(86°F liquid) per SCUBA tank

44.013 g/mol n2o

1.977 g/L (gas)

Reference Sources

#8 http://www.nationalipa.org/PDFpricingdocs/Harrell’s%20Southeast%20Price%20List%20March%201%202009.pdf

#9 http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20090118102336AAITQNU

#10 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nitrous_oxide

#11 http://hy.tsinghua.edu.cn/teacher/index_files/Page335.htm

#12 http://www.o2-technology.com/tech/TheNitrousOxideTemperaturePressureRelationship.pdf

February 8, 2011 at 7:30 pm #12573

tusavision
Subscriber

shredder7753 wrote:

answer the fucking QUESTION tusa!

What question?

No, the trash bags are for storing liquid water and air compressed to 33 ATM (1/33 it’s volume at 1 ATM)

February 8, 2011 at 7:33 pm #12574

shredder7753
Subscriber

tusavision wrote:

shredder7753 wrote:

answer the fucking QUESTION tusa!

What question?

No, the trash bags are for storing liquid water and air compressed to 33 ATM (1/33 it’s volume at 1 ATM)

[/quote]

u specified 200 NM offshore.

stationkeeping!

February 8, 2011 at 8:02 pm #12575

tusavision
Subscriber

tusavision wrote:

Price of Ammonium Nitrate $934.12/ton (reference source #8)

NH4NO3(s) —–>N2O(g) +2H2O(L) (reference source #9)

Moles N2O = 35 g / 44 g/mol= 0.795
the ratio is 1 : 1
Moles NH4NO3 needed = 0.795
Mass NH4NO3 = 0.795 mol x 80 g/mol= 63.6 g of NH4NO3 required to produce 35g of N2O

Catalytic Decomposition of Nitrous Oxide

activation energy: 1000°C(thermal) >200°C(catalytic)

reaction enthalpy: 82kJ/Mol

reaction temperature: 1300 °C (reference source #10)

2N2O(g) —> 2N2(g) + O2(g) + Heat (reference source #11)

97.7°F = Critical Temperature of N2O (reference source #12)

1069-1278 psi = Critical Pressure of N2O

Density(liquid @ 86°F) = 39.1 lb/cubic feet

Water Capacity of a AL80 SCUBA tank: 678 Cubic Inches(0.392361 ft³)

15.34lbs N20(86°F liquid) per SCUBA tank

44.013 g/mol n2o

1.977 g/L (gas)

Reference Sources

#8 http://www.nationalipa.org/PDFpricingdocs/Harrell’s%20Southeast%20Price%20List%20March%201%202009.pdf

#9 http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20090118102336AAITQNU

#10 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nitrous_oxide

#11 http://hy.tsinghua.edu.cn/teacher/index_files/Page335.htm

#12 http://www.o2-technology.com/tech/TheNitrousOxideTemperaturePressureRelationship.pdf

1 pound = 453.59237 grams

15.34*453.59=6958.7 grams of N2O per scuba tank (3519.8 Liters at 1 ATM)

Therefore:

1 AL80 SCUBA tank holds 158 mol of n2o

remembering that:

2N2O(g) —> 2N2(g) + O2(g) + Heat (reference source #11)

158N2O= 158N2 + 79O2

158(28.0134 g)+79(31.9989 g)=AL80 tank air production capacity in grams

4426+2527.9 = 6953.9 grams of air

weight of air = 1.294 kg/m3

5.37m^3 of air per scuba tank

1 cubic meter = 35.3146667 cubic feet

189.639 = cubic feet of air per AL80 scuba tank

energy produced per AL80 of N2O converted to air:

82kJ/Mol

158*82=12956kJ

Now that we know we want 158 mol of n2o, we can calculate the weight, volume, and price of the NH4NO3 precursor.

NH4NO3(s) —–>N2O(g) +2H2O(L)

158(NH4NO3)= 12646.85 grams of NH4NO3

12.647 kg of NH4NO3 = 1 AL80 of N2O + 316(18.0153 g water)

water production of 12.647 kg of NH4NO3 = 5.69kg h2o

February 8, 2011 at 8:06 pm #12576

tusavision
Subscriber

shredder7753 wrote:

tusavision wrote:

shredder7753 wrote:

answer the fucking QUESTION tusa!

What question?

No, the trash bags are for storing liquid water and air compressed to 33 ATM (1/33 it’s volume at 1 ATM)

[/quote]

u specified 200 NM offshore.

stationkeeping!

[/quote]

So long as I don’t get within 200 nm of land, I don’t have to stationkeep.

Particually if I’m in a gyre.

Otherwise, by controlling the buoyancy of the platform I can move in and out of wind/currents depending on their direction.

I also have more monopropellant than it would take to launch a satellite.

So stationkeeping isn’t a question. It’s trivial.
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